Marty: Hello and welcome to the podcast of the year podcast of the year so far today. Not your typical leadership coaching is the name of this podcast and you are welcome to join me and Bill Tierney. And my name is Martin Kettelhut, Bill Tierney. Um, and as we discuss coaching for leadership coaching, it often doesn't match the, the Kmart kind of coaching out there.

Bill: Hey, Marty, like template formula. Is that what you mean by Kmart?

Marty: That's exactly what I mean.

Bill: Okay. All right. You know, they're out of business, right?

Marty: Yes. That's the point. We don't want to go out of business. Yeah.

Bill: Yeah. But we were talking before we hit record today about, um, a project, project that you just designed. And, um, once you showed me your project and how you designed it, I suggested that we make that our topic today.

Marty: That's great. It's great. Both of my books have a section on project design and it's an important, it's an important Um, tool to have. It's an important practice. It can completely alter your relationship to that project and its success. Absolutely real matter. It's a very important thing.

Bill: So maybe we talk when we start by talking about and I just would like the listener to, um, know that we haven't prepared for this conversation. So, anything that we generate in the conversation is coming from what we already do, and maybe some new ideas that come along just because of the conversation that we're having. My suggestion is that we start by naming the elements of a, of a project, a successful project design.

Marty: Well, I think just the, the first 2 most important elements of my point of view, um, are the vision or what's possible and the structure that's going to sustain that possibility. Those seem to me like the two most basic elements of a project design, like, what's the dream and what's going to sustain us to getting it to realizing it

Bill: what is possible and what is the dream? That's the vision.

Marty: That's one. Yeah, that's the vision, right? And then what's the structure that's going to sustain that dream? And there's, there's more to say about each of those, but I think those are, you know, the two most basic elements in my opinion. What do you think?

Bill: If we back it up even a little bit further, and this doesn't answer the question of what are the elements, but it does bring I think that we might want to bring some clarity and not just assume that the listener understands what we mean when we say project design.

Marty: Okay?

Bill: So, what is it that we mean when we say project design? You want to take a run at it?

Marty: Well, a project is obviously more than a task, right? So you schedule a task. A time and it gets done in that time. Hopefully or not, but that's where is a project. It's going to involve. It's it's more involved. It's it's there are going to be many actions to take over a period of time to realize. So that's how you realize when you've got a project, like the project that I was talking to you about before we went on air here was a project of increasing my income. Like, that's not just a task. Okay. It's, you know, it's a project, you know, organizing a birthday party for a friend. It's not just a task. It's a project. Um,

Bill: so does, yeah, I'm hearing a project is more complex than a task. And in fact, often will involve many multiple tasks. Um, so it's complex. It has multiple moving parts, multiple tasks, many actions that are going to be required. And all of those tasks. all add up to the achievement of a predefined objective. And that predefined objective goes back to your vision. So a project is Um, I would say a plan. Um, well, no, let me say it this way. A project needs a plan if it's going to be.

Marty: Yeah,

Bill: but the project itself is what's going to happen within that plan to achieve that, that stated objective. Correct. And that plan has its own elements. So you mentioned that there's a vision. What is possible that would be the defined objective and then you said structure number 2 and within that structure would be the plan and the identification of the tasks and I want to throw in a 3rd element of understructure, which would be measurable milestones measurable progress markers

Marty: and I'll throw in another 1.

Bill: Okay.

Marty: Practices things that you not only they're not one offs. But there are things you're going to be doing over and over repeatedly, ongoingly, regularly in order to, to, you know, like, if the, if the project is to win the Super Bowl, you're going to have many rehearsals. You're going to run lots of laps. You're going to do lots of this and that and the other. So their practices as well.

Bill: Yeah, so that distinguishes between tasks. Which are one off, maybe the repeated, uh, tasks, uh, but practices are the ones that, that you need to do often, get better and better at, and, and possibly just, just do these practices to maintain and sustain. Um, a level that you can constantly be able to stand on and build from.

Marty: I like that you brought up milestones. I think there there that's a really rich topic. The milestones that go into the plan now, I'm going to tell you what I was taught about milestones. Yeah. Because it's. It's brilliant and it's, it's not always easy to do, but what I was taught is that you, you start at the end with what you're calling the defined objective, defined objective. We should say more about that too, but because I want to put it defined objective is a possibility that's got to have that. It's got to live in the realm of possibility, but we'll come back to that. But you look at that and you say, okay, what made that an inevitability? Like it really challenged yourself to say, okay, if we're going to be rolling downhill into this, like, in other words, like we're going to get, we're going to set this up so that we can't not get the result we want. What would that look like? That becomes your last milestone. And then you sit in that. That ultimate milestone before the, the achievement of the objective and you say, okay, so now let's say we've got that. Let's say if you're planning, the project is a plan, the birthday party for the friend. Let's just use an example to concretize it a little bit. So, that ultimate might be all the invitations have been sent out. All the food has been bought. The room has been rented. It's going to happen that's inevitable now, right? There's nothing more. It's just, we just let it unfold at this point. Okay. So then what's the pen ultimate such that the ultimate milestone, what, what made, what makes that ultimate milestone and inevitability? Love it. Yeah, that's great. And then, so that you, you're putting a plan together in such a way that the project It's just gonna, it's just gonna fall open. That's that you, you don't want to be having to climb uphill and effort your way up to the achievement of the goal. You want to write the plan in such a way that it just keeps falling open in front of you.

Bill: So in

Marty: the, so in the birthday example, I mentioned all the invitations having been sent out is the ultimate. So maybe before that it's, you know, making sure you bought all the invitations or that you know, that you wrote them out, maybe buying them as a milestone before that, but you sent them all out and the post office is working , right? The food's been bought. Oh, was the ultimate. So maybe we need a meal plan and money. Is the penultimate right? So you start and you keep thinking your way back in this way until you get to this moment and what there is to do now. So the, the project plan is beautiful when you put it together in this way, because now you don't have to get up every morning and figure out what to do. How am I going to make this happen? It's it's all there step of the way makes the next step happen. So this is the, this is the best way to plan.

Bill: I, I used to do yearly planning workshops for real estate agents was when I was in the mortgage business. As a loan officer, I would gather real estate agents from all over the city, and we would gather together, and typically I'd get about 20 real estate agents in a conference room, and we'd spend about four hours together, and we would do this. I would ask them to plan out the year, and that's, that was the name of the workshop every year, so it was planning 2012, planning 2014, whatever it is, making the year, things like that. And people would show up, I'd have them, you know, I'd issue them. Notebooks and then those notebooks that would be a little bit of content, but mostly there was blank notebook paper because they're going to be doing a whole lot of writing and designing during, during the workshop. Often the real estate agents would say, what I want to do is measure. I want to, the objective that I want to accomplish by the end of this next following year, it is this much an income or this much in sales, but, but it's, it's some version of that. It was rarely something like, I want to be the top producer in the city, or I want to be in the top 10%. It could be that. But then that would, that would mean that we'd have to break that down. What does it mean to be in the top 10%? How is that measured? What would that measurement need to be? So, so something that's, that was really important and is really important in any project design, I would say is that the objective itself needs to be measurable. So, if my objective is to be happier, how do you measure that? How will we measure that? Yeah. And it needs to be measured in a way that's, that's pretty black and white. Either I achieved it or I didn't. Was I happier? Eh, I think so. It's not a good answer. It's not a way to measure it. Right. Right. Or, no, I think I was about as happy as I was, no. So that's, there's really not a practical way to measure that yet, but we can produce one. What are the, what are the conditions that you know? Exist in, in your life when you're happy. And that might be one way to measure it. And then assigning a gradient of value one to 10, let's say.

Marty: So I think we're making a very important distinction here that I wasn't before. So I want to acknowledge there's a difference between the possibility of the project and the measurable achievement. Right. So what do you get? Out of the achievement and that's measurable. What does that give you? You know, is it, um, you know, having acknowledged your friend, right? That your friend had a great birthday or is it that you like, in my case that I achieved a certain income level, right? Those things are measurable, but the possibility is. What, like, it's going to be more aspirate. It's going to sound more aspirational. It's going to be like a, an emotion or a state of, you know, something that you, that you want to feel. Right.

Bill: Yes. Yes. And so what you're describing now is the second step that I would take people through in this workshop. First, let's, let's get a measurable result that you want to achieve. How will you know that you achieve this? Well, so if someone says, I want to, I want to earn 250, 000 in commissions in, in this, in this next year, now they have a measurable objective.

Marty: Yes.

Bill: The next step then would be to get into inspiration and motivation.

Marty: It might go the other way around, that you might get the inspiration first and then create a measurable, right? It could go the other way, couldn't

Bill: it? I'm just, I'm just describing the method that I used when I was working with real estate agents. Once they came up with that number, I believed and still do believe that, that deep down inside, they grabbed that number and it may have been just a random number. They may later find out once they begin to explore. The possibility and, and, and how important it is to them that they achieve it, that that number needs to change somehow.

Marty: Right.

Bill: Right. Decrease. But we just started with an idea, a number or a measurable. And then I, there was a set of questions that I would ask to, and it always started out with, um, what's important to achieve. What is important to you about achieving that?

Marty: That's the question. And the first

Bill: time I ever heard that question asked was in a workshop that I attended that was put on by Joe Stump. And Joe Stump runs a company called Buy Referral Only. I think he still has the company and I think it's still doing very, very well. And he offered trainings to real estate agents and mortgage lenders. And so I learned a lot from him and then took that into the workshops that I did. So question number one, what's important to you about this? Question number two refers to the answer to question number one. What's important to you about that? Number three, you want to guess? Go ahead. What's important to you about that? I think he went as four or five

Marty: layers deep. Yeah, there's, I'm trying to think of the, there's a, there's a financial advisor coach. He's from the San Diego area. Very big, maybe 15 years ago, but his whole method is about that. Okay. You ask the client as a financial advisor, you know, what's whatever it is that the client says, I want to, I want an IRA or I want. You know, to invest in Nestle or, you know, I want to save what's important to you about that and what's important to you about that. And what's important to you about that. And what's important to do that until you get to this start shaking with, Oh my God, I could have joy or I could have freedom that, and that's a very important piece of a project plan. Is that, that. Possibility that the project

Bill: is, I want to tell you another brief story that came out, came out of the mortgage business. Um, I had been working part time as a coach for about 4 years, uh, before I quit my mortgage originator job and went full time as a coach. The day that I made the decision, um, to quit my mortgage job, I realized I had achieved my goal. I had a, I had an objective. I had a plan. I had a, had done a project design and I used exactly the same project design that I had just been trained in, in the coach training program that I, that I started six months earlier. Essentially it was, I want to work full time as a coach and I want to stop being a mortgage loan officer. Bye. June of 2016. And I will do that when I have had An average over the previous six months of 2, 500 in coaching income. That November the sales manager at the bank mortgage division, where I worked said, I want to have an appointment with each of you loan officers by December 15th for your plan for next year. And here's the, here's the form that I want you to use. So he handed out these forms at a sales meeting and my, and he said, I want you to make an appointment. So I made an appointment with him. I believe it was for December 10th, December 9th or something like that. And that was a Friday and, and I, you know, the Thursday before I filled it out. I will do these things. This is what I'm, this is what I plan to generate for loan volume next year. And in order to do that, that means I need to average this much every month in loan loans, funded loans. And to do that, I'm going to talk to this many realtors and I'm going to, I'm going to do this newsletter and I'm going to take these actions. And so I put together the plan and I looked at it and I thought, God, this can work. I can hit these numbers if I'll take these actions. And then when I realized I have a plan seven months from now to be out of the business altogether, but I'm going to go ahead and work the plan anyhow, uh, of course, and be as successful as I can as a loan officer. Before I closed the books and prepared for my meeting the next day with my sales manager, I looked at the numbers for the past six months as a coach that I had generated. The number was 2, 542 or something like that. I mean, it was above that six month average that I said I needed to hit so that I could go full time by June of the next year. So I kept my appointment and I walked into the sales manager's office and I said, here is a great plan. And if someone actually works this plan, it's going to work to produce that much of volume. And my sales manager said, that's great. You must be excited. I said, I am excited because I'm quitting. What? I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. What? I said, yeah, I'm quitting. This is a great plan. Let somebody else use it. I'm quitting. Why? I said, I set a goal six months, six months ago for one year from that date. I would, I would go full time as a coach. I've already achieved the goal. I'm going to become a coach starting today. He said, well, when are you done with, when are you done here? I said today. This is it. And so I left. That was it. I became a full time coach that day. How exciting.

Marty: Well, it's a great, it's a beautiful story. And it's also illustrative of one of the, one of the reasons why having a plan for a project is so important because it gives you confidence. You see what's actually happening now, you know, Everybody in his brother, including me is will say, well, I know what's happening. I don't need to have it written down. What are you talking about? It makes a difference because you see shit like this. You see, like, oh, my gosh, we've hit our number. You know, we don't have to keep rack in our brain or things like that. Or you see, like. You know, we're doing these three things to generate and this one is really not producing. Let's do more of this one instead and get about this. Yeah,

Bill: yeah. And so in 1 of the books that I read and I wish I could remember something about disciplines and business and goal setting my daughter when she listens to this will remind me of it because she she recommended the book. I'm looking over at my bookshelf to see if I still have it, but something like the seven disciplines of blah, blah, blah. Um, in that book, they talked about lead and lag measures. Are you familiar? Yeah. Okay. All right. I'd never heard of, heard of it before. Um, so the objective would be a lag measure, meaning that, the result itself lag lags behind all the actions that you take to get there. Uh huh. The measures of the actions that you will take to get there. The measures of the strategies employed. Those are the lead measures. What will I do? I'll, I'll, I'll put out a weekly newsletter. I will build an email list. I will ask for referrals every single time. I will get 30 Google five star reviews. I will, so on and so forth. Those are all lead measures. Did I do it or not? I only did 26. I said I was going to do 30. Okay. What do I want to do about that? So on and so forth. So that's part of the plan as well. I've got a plan that's, that starts out as you say. With the end in mind, that's our defined objective. our lag measure, and then we start throwing stuff against the wall. Like, what will I do? Don't worry about what until we've got our motivation. Why, what's important about it? Why is it so important to achieve this? Then once those two steps are taken, what I've done in the past is, now, what kinds of things could I do? And just throw everything against the wall. I could do this. I could

Marty: do that. Go ahead. And just to clarify for the audience, like, that question occurs in the planning state. This is not you never you never get up in the implementation stage and say, what should we throw against the wall today? Because it's you follow the plan at that point.

Bill: Say more about that. I'm not sure that I'm as clear.

Marty: That's the whole reason for having a plan. Right. I know most, most of the people that I've worked with. And they're great people. So this is not a criticism, but they get up and they sit at their desk and they're like, okay, what, what, what shall I do today to try and generate some business? Oh, right. Lacking any plan. Yes. If you've got what we're talking about, a project design, then you take that out and you do what it says. Yes. You don't have to worry and flustered about, well, I don't know what to do today. It's in the plan.

Bill: That's right. And as you said just a few minutes ago, if when you look at that plan and it says do this, but you know that doing that doesn't produce the results that you need, it's time to reset your plan, at least to that degree.

Marty: I just remembered the, that coach's name for those who are interested, who coaches financial advisors and ask this question, what's important to you about money? And what's important to you about that? And what's important to you? His name is Bill Bachrach. Okay. And he's out of San Diego. That's right. Bill Bacrack. B A C

Bill: H R A C H. All right. Uh, and, and that makes me want to look, um, for the, the book that I was trying to, to think, to find.

Marty: Mm

Bill: hmm. And it's not popping up immediately. So I'll, I'll get ahold of my daughter and ask her what was the name of that book.

Marty: In the, in the scribing, like, cause you're demonstrating this is the best way to say it. I think you're by making a plan, you're demonstrating for yourself how it's going to happen. It's like a mathematical proof. Like, oh, we've got these 8 apples and there are 4 of us. How's this going to work? You know, and you, you take 8 and you divide it by 2 or by 4 and you get, oh, we each get 2. It's demonstrable. That's what, that's what a project design is. It's a demonstration of how you're going to achieve the goal. And so 1 of the things that a tip I would call this, so this is, is to put the goal. And what's possible at the very top so that every time you look at it, you have to look at you look through that at your plan. Right? Like, the 1 that that we were talking about my project design. It says right up at the top ease and abundance. That's what every step of this has got to have. To be imbued with is ease and abundance. That's what I will have achieved when the project has been realized to is ease and abundance. So you want everything to have those energies flowing through it. So write it at the very top, like the, that's, that's what it's about.

Bill: That's great. Really great. Let's begin to summarize a little bit here because we're running short on time. If someone is listening to this and they think, okay, great. That was a lot of information. It wasn't really in a linear fashion. I'm not, I would love to know what to do and how to leverage what I've just learned or to have summarized what I've just learned so I can leverage it. Uh, let's let's see if maybe we can attempt to combine all that we've talked about into a linear almost instructions for how to design a project and what to keep in mind while you're doing it

Marty: before doing that. Um, you can also look up look this up. It's already been put down on paper in the book. Listen till you disappear in chapter 12, which is titled being done all the way to being done. That's the name of the chapter being done all the way to being done there. I've laid out this in a linear order. Oh, good. Well, then let's, we

Bill: don't need to do that.

Marty: Well, we might still want to do it.

Bill: Well, I suppose if somebody hasn't gotten your book yet, they, and, and they, they're, or they're going to order it and it's going to be a while before they have it. They could get it in Kindle, right?

Marty: Yes.

Bill: Well, and you can, they, they could buy it. Get

Marty: it

Bill: in soft cover too.

Marty: Yeah.

Bill: So let's start with what you call the vision. Let's just keep it to these two pieces that you identified, the two elements, vision and structure.

Marty: Um,

Bill: and what you were suggesting, and this is exactly what I do as well. And that, that is, what is it that you want to accomplish? That's, we start with, with the end. Um, I guess one more thing I want to throw in about that as a possibility that seems to work very, very well with my clients is that, that every possible element of the inspiration and motivational questions, like what's important to you about this. Is used to write an aspirational results statement that defines that objective. So it's written in present tense and it's no more than a short paragraph, but, but includes as many of those, of those. Um, fundamental elements that come from your answers of what's important to you about it, as well as the number itself, or the measurable itself. So I build tyranny in living in this particular way with this particular result. And so I enjoy these benefits from that. And when I read it, I know, is it true? Is that my life? Am I describing reality yet or not? No, obviously I haven't achieved my project yet. Right. Right.

Marty: Right. Right. Very good. Really important. The reason just in case somebody's wondering why in the present tense, because you're, you're, it's like painting a picture. You want to be able to see the result in front of you. So you just describe, Oh, I'm doing this. I'm feeling that people are responding in this way. This is what's happening. Cause that's where we're going.

Bill: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Very good. Yes. And the other thing is that it, it Kind of reignites the, the enthusiasm and the motivation and inspiration for doing it. Each time you read it. Oh, yeah, this is where I'm going. I'm reminding myself of why this is why I'm putting in whatever effort I'm putting into it. This is this is why I'm taking the actions. This is why I'm being disciplined. This is why I'm holding myself accountable. Yeah.

Marty: Right. So we've got that. That's the 1st step is the, the vision. What's possible and the measures that you're, what you're measuring. So that's the beginning. And then next comes working backwards from the end toward today by filling in the milestones along the way.

Bill: Which you did in the project design that you shared with me before we hit record today. You had, you had your ultimate goal. Objective is, is realized, I think, five months from now, you had a measurable for four months from now, you had a measurable for three months from now, and you had a measurable for two and one months from now, those measurables were both. How much you needed to achieve to give yourself the possibility to get the result that you wanted at each milestone. And for you, it was, it was income was the ultimate objective that would be measured and determined five months from now, whether or not you achieved your project. Each month prior to that was also a measurable amount of income, but that was also coupled with how many people you needed to talk to, assuming a particular number of those people are going to end up hiring you. Correct. Generate that income. Um, so in that way, whether you call them milestones or not, that's what you did. So here's the milestone. By this date, this is, I should

Marty: be at this mile marker. Yeah, I didn't label it in my plan, but that's exactly what they are. Milestones. Yes. Yes.

Bill: Once we have milestones, then the how shows up. That's when we start throwing stuff on the wall. Once you have your milestones, I need to be here by this date. How am I going to do that? And you put that in your project design as well. You're going to have this kind of networking. You're going to have this kind of outreach. You're going to have this kind of marketing. You're going to be taking these kinds of actions. And I don't know how much you put into that, but by the time you showed it to me, you had filtered it all down into four or five different strategies, essentially, that you will be engaged in between now and the achievement of this project goal.

Marty: Right. Or

Bill: objective.

Marty: Mm hmm.

Bill: What, what are we missing here? We talked about inspiration and motivation earlier, and that's somewhere between what is the objective and why is it important? And out of that can come what I would call the aspirational result statement. Move to milestones. If you're going to be at this measurable objective by this particular date, the divide now, the amount of time between now and then, break that down in increments. It can be weekly, monthly, it can be quarterly, it can be annually, depends on how far out the objective is. What's it going to look like then? And what's it going to look like then? And what's it going to look like? So you get to what's it going to look like at the closest measurable milestone? And what do I need to do now to get from here to that closest measurable milestone?

Marty: So one thing, one big thing that's missing, we haven't talked about is accountability.

Bill: Yeah.

Marty: This is all just, you know, a pipe dream if you're not sharing it. And involving others in it. So that, that's a big, that's a big important factor. Who's holding you accountable? Who's your team? You know, who are the people that you're going to be interacting with to make this happen? Because it doesn't happen in a vacuum or in a silo. Let's talk about who those, those people

Bill: could be. Who, who is going to be motivated and invested enough to be willing to be your accountability partner? Well, coaches are

Marty: great for that. I would also look at some who's in that vision, who's in there with you, right? They might be interested in the outcome of this project and want to be involved and need to be involved.

Bill: And that's brilliant. And, and someone else that would be equally motivated and invested in being your accountability partner would be someone who agrees to design their own project and have you be their accountability partner. That's beautiful. Which is something I recommend to my clients that are, that hire me for achieving objectives.

Marty: The only other thing, and I know when you want to wrap up and so do I, but is the, you know, the, there's, a lot to say about those milestones and what you choose as your milestones. And, and we talked a little bit about making them in reverse order. Create the inevitability of the next 1. that's that's 1 way when I, when I, we did projects in my leadership program, we thought in, we did it a different way. We thought in terms of the milestones as being. Clearings, like there's stuff and this is one way to think about it. There's stuff in the way of me getting to the goal. And so you think of the milestones as having cleared things like, okay, we got, we, we cleared the obstacle of, you know, this person being against us and we cleared the obstacle of every time I do this kind of thing, I have negative self talk. We're that obstacle you think of it is and then the way just opens up to you achieving what you want. That's another way to think about the milestones. We

Bill: have solved the problem of how to fly. If we're going to stand on the moon, we have solved the problem of how to fly, or we have solved the problem of, of how to move this, this physical body from here to there. Yes, I would do that. Right. Right. And Wilbur Wright, they're saying, how do you solve the problem of flight so that we can go distances at a faster rate? Yes, exactly. Really great point. So I, and I made a note earlier about anticipated challenges.

Marty: Mm hmm.

Bill: And, and how those will be dealt with. And if you already know, using the, the ridiculous example that I just used, we don't know how to fly yet. So, how are we going to solve that problem? If you already know that, that that's a problem that needs to be solved, what's going to be the challenge in doing that? Well, uh, we don't have any idea how to design a machine that will, that will actually fly yet. And so how do we want, how do we want to approach that? How do we want to overcome that challenge? Um, and also what's good, what kind of mindset is going to be required? One of the anticipated challenges will be discouragement. When things don't work out and I get discouraged, what do I know about myself? Do I quit? And what would help me to not quit if that's going to happen? So one of the other things that I often do with my clients is that we will talk about what have you done in the past to sabotage yourself so that you don't have success. And what do we want to do about that going in before we start this new project? Right,

Marty: like, my project in the leadership program, the last round required of me when I looked at the design of the plan, it required me to fire my admin and get a better 1 because I saw, like, with this admin, I'm not going to get there. I need somebody who is more versed at this, can do this better, has better communication. And so that was 1 of the things I needed to clear to open the way to my success. You

Bill: know, something that, that we're really talking about, but haven't named, and that is the, the willingness and the ability to look at, look at things as they are, rather than lying to ourselves or avoiding the harsh realities of what the challenge is going to be to achieve it. If we're not already achieving it, it's either because we haven't thought of it yet. Or, because we, we've been overwhelmed by the challenges that we anticipate it's going to present and we don't even try. That's what we've tried failed and had given up.

Marty: Yeah,

Bill: so. In order, if we are going to achieve something that's worth achieving, that's not been achieved before, that means that we're going to face challenges and we need, we need to find the willingness to stick to it long enough to actually achieve the result, no matter how discouraging it can get. That mindset is probably the thing that stops us from achieving what we want to achieve that we haven't achieved yet more than anything else.

Marty: Amen.

Bill: Good place to stop. All right. Till next time, Marty. Take care. You too. That concludes another episode of Not Your Typical Leadership Coaching. We hope you found inspiration and valuable insights to fuel your leadership journey. Remember, true leadership is not about you. It's about empowering others. Take your insights to heart and cultivate a leadership mindset that will transform you from within. Thank you for joining us on this quest to leadership excellence. Don't forget to subscribe and stay tuned for our upcoming episodes where we delve deeper into the art of leadership. Until next time, remember that you have the power to lead with confidence and compassion from the inside out.